In the first part, I explained that Marcus Grodi, a convert to the Roman church (RC) and host on The Journey Home, has a list of ten verses that influenced him to consider conversion to the RC. The tenth and final verse is Luke 1:46-49.
Luke 1:46 And Mary said, My soul doth magnify the Lord, 47 And my spirit hath rejoiced in God my Saviour. 48 For he hath regarded the low estate of his handmaiden: for, behold, from henceforth all generations shall call me blessed. 49 For he that is mighty hath done to me great things; and holy is his name. 50 And his mercy is on them that fear him from generation to generation. 51 He hath shewed strength with his arm; he hath scattered the proud in the imagination of their hearts. 52 He hath put down the mighty from their seats, and exalted them of low degree. 53 He hath filled the hungry with good things; and the rich he hath sent empty away. 54 He hath holpen his servant Israel, in remembrance of his mercy; 55 As he spake to our fathers, to Abraham, and to his seed for ever.
I’ve written on Mary previously, but will add to the conversation. Marcus focuses in on “all generations shall call be blessed.” I have absolutely no problem with the idea in general…all generations, to my knowledge, agree that she was blessed by being asked to carry Jesus, and by the fact that she accepted.
Now, where the major differences come in, is that we protestants (in general) see what else this passage teaches us; Mary was in need of a saviour (“God my Saviour”), that implies she had indeed sinned, for that is what separates us from God and makes it necessary to have a saviour, and that she was just as sinful as the rest of us (“the low estate of His handmaiden”).
There is no implication of the claims that the Roman church makes about Mary. She isn’t referred to here as the mother of the Church (or as the “Mother of God,” though Jesus is indeed God), nor is there any reference to the immaculate conception. Just because we don’t see any evidence for the RC position on Mary, does not mean we dishonor the real Mary.
Marcus acts as though protestants view Mary as being “used” by God and then put to the side. This isn’t the case, Mary modeled proper reaction to God when she agreed to God’s will in faith. The protestant position would actually lend itself to seeing her as a role model in faith. She was just like us; born with a sin nature, yet in this instance she responded in faith.
Jesus backs this idea up quite nicely; Luke 11:27 And it came to pass, as he spake these things, a certain woman of the company lifted up her voice, and said unto him, Blessed is the womb that bare thee, and the paps which thou hast sucked. 28 But he said, Yea rather, blessed are they that hear the word of God, and keep it.
As well as; Matthew 12:46 While he yet talked to the people, behold, his mother and his brethren stood without, desiring to speak with him. 47 Then one said unto him, Behold, thy mother and thy brethren stand without, desiring to speak with thee. 48 But he answered and said unto him that told him, Who is my mother? and who are my brethren? 49 And he stretched forth his hand toward his disciples, and said, Behold my mother and my brethren! 50 For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother.
Note one more time that in verse 50, we are put exactly on par with Mary, as Jesus’ mother, if we do the will of the Father. I see nothing in the Luke chapter 1 verses that supports the RC understanding of who and what they claim Mary to be.
I will be making one final post to wrap up these 10 verses, and list the links to all of them on my blog.
Excellent, Kliska!
Luke 1: 46-49, focuses on who the child, Mary was carrying (Jesus), would become, not Mary. Mary, as she claims, was blessed, just as we are blessed when we submit ourselves to the will of God: nothing more, nothing less.
The question I have always had, after being RC for over eight years, is if Mary is all that the RC doctrine makes her out to be, then why are women, in general, held back from serving as priests? It seems, to me, like an irrational double standard?
The main reason I’ve heard argued is that Christ had the apostles; all male…and of course, some of Paul’s teachings. I’ll have to blog on the idea of women deacons, pastors, teachers, preachers, evangelizers, etc… sometime.
I guess one of the parts that bothers me the most, is that there is indeed only one mediator between us and the Father; and that mediator is Jesus. When RC tradition claims Mary takes our petitions (aimed at her) to Jesus, and then Jesus would mediate, that is a contradiction of scripture.
“When RC tradition claims Mary takes our petitions (aimed at her) to Jesus, and then Jesus would mediate, that is a contradiction of scripture.”
Yes, since Jesus said, “ask the Father…” He never indicated that we should pray to anyone else.
Throw in our “model” prayer; “Our Father which art in Heaven…” and I agree that it is obvious.
Let me start off by saying it is an honor to comment. I have a few red flags I’d like to stake concerning your position. I’ll start out with a quite from your post,
“Mary was in need of a saviour (”God my Saviour”), that implies she had indeed sinned, for that is what separates us from God and makes it necessary to have a saviour, and that she was just as sinful as the rest of us (”the low estate of His handmaiden”)”. Now, I’m not going to say that I speak for Mr. Grodi, although I am sure he would agree with me.
As you have said, the biggest reason non-Catholics have for objecting to the Immaculate Conception and Mary’s consequent sinlessness is that we are told that “all have sinned” (Rom. 3:23). Besides, they say, Mary said her “spirit rejoices in God my Savior” (Luke 1:47), and only a sinner needs a Savior. Let’s take the second citation first. Mary, too, required a Savior. Like all other descendants of Adam, she was subject to the necessity of contracting original sin. But by a special intervention of God, undertaken at the instant she was conceived, she was preserved from the stain of original sin and its consequences. She was therefore redeemed by the grace of Christ, but in a special way—by anticipation. Consider an analogy: Suppose a man falls into a deep pit, and someone reaches down to pull him out. The man has been “saved” from the pit. Now imagine a woman walking along, and she too is about to topple into the pit, but at the very moment that she is to fall in, someone holds her back and prevents her. She too has been saved from the pit, but in an even better way: She was not simply taken out of the pit, she was prevented from getting stained by the mud in the first place. This is the illustration Christians have used for a thousand years to explain how Mary was saved by Christ. By receiving Christ’s grace at her conception, she had his grace applied to her before she was able to become mired in original sin and its stain. “How probable is it that God wished for the woman chosen to bring Jesus Christ into the world to be as pure and worthy as any human being could be?” Or maybe it sounds even more clear when stated negatively: “How probable is it that God would allow Jesus Christ to take His flesh from, be nourished for nine months in the womb of, be born of, be nursed from, and be raised by a woman tainted by original sin?” The Catechism of the Catholic Church states that she was “redeemed in a more exalted fashion, by reason of the merits of her Son” (CCC 492). She has more reason to call God her Savior than we do, because he saved her in an even more glorious manner! But what about Romans 3:23, “all have sinned”? Paul’s words “all have sinned”. The word used for “all” in the original Greek version, which is the language in which Paul wrote, is “pas”. “Pas” does not always mean every single one, but the rather a vast majority, most, or a great amount. We can see other times in the Bible where “all” is used, but clearly does not mean every single one:
“I myself am convinced about you, my brothers, that you yourselves are full of goodness, filled with all knowledge, and able to admonish one another.” [Romans 15:14]
In this part, “all” certainly does not mean every single one. If it did, the Romans, who had all knowledge, would have had the knowledge of God!
Have all people committed actual sins? Consider a child below the age of reason. By definition he can’t sin, since sinning requires the ability to reason and the ability to intend to sin. This is indicated by Paul later in the letter to the Romans when he speaks of the time when Jacob and Esau were unborn babies as a time when they “had done nothing either good or bad” (Rom. 9:11). We also know of another very prominent exception to the rule: Jesus (Heb. 4:15). So if Paul’s statement in Romans 3 includes an exception for the New Adam (Jesus), one may argue that an exception for the New Eve (Mary) can also be made. Paul’s comment seems to have one of two meanings. It might be that it refers not to absolutely everyone, but just to the mass of mankind (which means young children and other special cases, like Jesus and Mary, would be excluded without having to be singled out). If not that, then it would mean that everyone, without exception, is subject to original sin, which is true for a young child, for the unborn, even for Mary—but she, though due to be subject to it, was preserved by God from it and its stain. The objection is also raised that if Mary were without sin, she would be equal to God. I would have to say this is one of the most absurd arguments. In the beginning, God created Adam, Eve, and the angels without sin, but none were equal to God. Most of the angels never sinned, and all souls in heaven are without sin. This does not detract from the glory of God, but manifests it by the work he has done in sanctifying his creation. Sinning does not make one human. On the contrary, it is when man is without sin that he is most fully what God intends him to be. The dogma is especially fitting when one examines the honor that was given to the Ark of the Covenant. It contained the manna (bread from heaven), stone tablets of the Ten Commandments (the word of God), and the staff of Aaron (a symbol of Israel’s high priesthood). Because of its contents, it was made of incorruptible wood, and Psalm 132:8 said, “Arise, O Lord, and go to thy resting place, thou and the ark of thy might.” If this vessel was given such honor, how much more should Mary be kept from corruption, since she is the new ark—who carried the real bread from heaven, the Word of God, and the high priest of the New Covenant, Jesus Christ. Wow! Some argue that the new ark is not Mary, but the body of Jesus. Even if this were the case, it is worth noting that 1 Chronicles 15:14 records that the persons who bore the ark were to be sanctified. There would be no sense in sanctifying men who carried a box, and not sanctifying the womb who carried God himself! After all, wisdom will not dwell “in a body under debt of sin” (Wis. 1:4 NAB).
The Ark of the Old Covenant was the holding place for the Ten Commandments, which was the word of God. In the Bible, St. John calls Jesus the word of God as well, and Mary, by carrying Him in her womb, became the Ark of the New Covenant. The Ark of the Covenant is a holy and pure thing. If Mary had original sin, she would not have been pure, and therefore could not have been the Ark of the New Covenant. This idea is presented in the Bible when we compare the Old Testament to the New Testament. Notice these similarities:
Old Covenant: This is when the ark of the covenant was brought before King David.
“David feared the LORD that day and said, ‘How can the ark of the LORD come to me?’.” 2 Samuel 6:9
New Covenant: This is when Mary went to visit her cousin Elizabeth, who was pregnant with John the Baptist.
“And how does this happen to me, that the mother of my Lord should come to me?” Luke 1:43
Old Covenant: This is when the prophet David danced for joy because he was in the presence of the ark, which held the word of God.
“Saul’s daughter Michal looked down through the window and saw King David leaping and dancing before the LORD.” 2 Samuel 6:16
New Covenant: This is when the prophet John the Baptist leaped for joy while in his mother Elizabeth’s womb. He did this when he heard the voice of Mary, who was pregnant with Jesus, who is also called the Word of God.
“When Elizabeth heard Mary’s greeting, the infant leaped in her womb, and Elizabeth, filled with the Holy Spirit.” Luke 1:41
Old Covenant: The Israelites were filled with great joy because they were so close to the ark that held the word of God.
“As he and all the Israelites were bringing up the ark of the LORD with shouts of joy and to the sound of the horn.” 2 Samuel 6:15
New Covenant: This shows how filled with joy Elizabeth and John the Baptist were to be in the presence of Mary, who held the Word of God.
“Elizabeth cried out in a loud voice and said, ‘Most blessed are you among women, and blessed is the fruit of your womb!’.” Luke 1:42
“For at the moment the sound of your greeting reached my ears, the infant in my womb leaped for joy.” Luke 1:44
If this is true, that Mary is the Ark of the New Covenant, then she must have been pure, and could not have any sin on her soul. The fact that Mary was born without original sin has been a clear teaching of not only the Catholic Church, but of the founders of Protestantism as well. Only recently have some denominations gone away from this traditional Christian teaching.
“It is a sweet and pious belief that the infusion of Mary’s soul was effected without original sin; so that in the very infusion of her soul she was also purified from original sin and adorned with God’s gifts, receiving a pure soul infused by God; thus from the first moment she began to live she was free from all sin.” [Martin Luther; "Sermon On the Day of the Conception of the Mother of God", 1527]
The Immaculate Conception of Mary, the Mother of Jesus, is the belief that God preserved Mary from any inclination to sin, the inheritance of original sin passed on to all mankind from our first parents, Adam and Eve. The belief of the Immaculate Conception of Mary says nothing about Mary and personal sin (Rom 3:23).
Christian belief holds that every human being through faith and through baptism is freed from sin – original sin and personal sin – through the grace of Jesus Christ. Roman Catholic Christians simply claim that Mary was the first one to whom this was done.
The basis for the belief in the Immaculate Conception of Mary can be found in the Biblical revelation of holiness and the opposite of that state, sinfulness.
God is revealed as perfect interior holiness.
Is 6:3
“Holy, holy, holy is the Lord of hosts!” they (the Seraphim) cried one to the other.
No sin or anything tainted with sin can stand in the face of the holiness of God. “Enmity” is that mutual hatred between Mary and sin, between Christ and sin.
Gen 3:15
I will put enmity between you (the serpent, Satan) and the woman (Mary), and between your offspring (minions of Satan) and hers (Jesus); He will strike at your head, while you strike at his heel.
For the birth of God as a human being, God was interested in the condition of the mother’s womb. For even a great, but imperfect, judge of Israel, Samson, God was directive about the state of the mother during the pregnancy. The request for the mother to be pure is repeated for emphasis.
Judges 13:3-4
An angel of the LORD appeared to the woman and said to her, “Though you are barren and have had no children, yet you will conceive and bear a son. Now, then, be careful to take no wine or strong drink and to eat nothing unclean.”
Judges 13:7
“But he (the angel) said to me, ‘You will be with child and will bear a son. So take neither wine nor strong drink, and eat nothing unclean. For the boy shall be consecrated to God from the womb, until the day of his death.’ ”
Judges 13:13-14
The angel of the LORD answered Manoah, “Your wife is to abstain from all the things of which I spoke to her. She must not eat anything that comes from the vine, nor take wine or strong drink, nor eat anything unclean. Let her observe all that I have commanded her.”
How much more would God be interested in the state of His own mother’s womb!
The salutation of the Angel Gabriel is different from the usual angelic greeting. It indicates that Mary was exceptionally “highly favored with grace” (Greek: charitooxarito-
Definition
to make graceful, charming, lovely, agreeable, to peruse with grace, compass with favour, to honour with blessings
Translated Words
KJV (2) – be highly favoured, 1; make accepted, 1;
NAS (2) – favored, 1; freely bestowed, 1;
Verse Count-KJV NAS: Luke 1, Ephesians 1, Luke 1, Ephesians 1
This shows it used twice in the New Testament, in Lk 1:28 for Mary – before Christ’s redemption; and Eph 1:6 for Christ’s grace to us – after Christ’s redemption).
Lk 1:28
And coming to her (Mary), he (the angel Gabriel) said, “Hail, favored one (kecharitomene)”
Eph 1:4-6
(God) chose us in him (Jesus), before the foundation of the world, to be holy and without blemish before him. In love he destined us for adoption to himself through Jesus Christ, in accord with the favor of his will, for the praise of the glory of his grace (echaritosen) that he granted us in the beloved.
Note that the angel’s salutation preceded Mary’s acquiescence. Pause on this for a second. Mary was already highly favored. God’s grace was not given in time after Mary accepted the angel’s word. The Church believes that this grace was given from the very beginning of Mary’s life. It is clearly grace because at the time of Mary’s conception she could have done nothing to earn it.
The constant faith (paradosis) of the Church attests to the belief in the special preparation of the holiness of the person of Mary to bear in her body the most holy person of the Son of God.
May the peace of the lord be with you.
“May the peace of the Lord be with you.”
And also with you; welcome to my blog. First…you’ve left a pretty long comment, and it would be a lot easier to address if it were broken up. I’ll post a whole new blog post on the first part of your comment and we’ll go from there.
Second…please, if you copy and paste a chunk of text from another website make sure you indicate that you have and that you provide the link. You’ve cut and pasted here, without telling me who the real author is. It is much much easier to dialogue back and forth if you try to put things in your own words, and it shows me you come here seeking truth, and not just trying to sway me to your POV. And also, if the material is copyrighted, that can be plagiarism.
As I said, I’ll be making a new post to address the first part of the “immaculate conception” issue in your comment; Mary in need of a Saviour?
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